Igniting Imagination: Leadership Ministry

Bonus Episode: “Disruptive Trends Impacting Churches”

February 10, 2022

Vice President of Leadership Ministry and host Rev. Lisa Greenwood welcomes guests Rev. Rachel Billups and Rev. Matt Rawle to discuss disruptive trends impacting churches. Drawing from recent articles about 2022 trends by Carey Nieuwhof, Joe Park, and Thom Rainer, the three discuss how multi-access is here to stay, the shift to more decentralized power, the role of authority, giving permission to play, less givers giving more…and so much more! This engaging conversation will surely ignite your imagination for what God may be inviting you to consider in your context this year and beyond. 


See our show notes for an invitation to email us your reflections from today’s topic for a chance to win a copy of Gil Rendle’s book “Quietly Courageous.”



  • “As we’re moving forward, even myself, I have to let go of the fear of what I know and step into something I don’t know.” -Rev. Rachel Billups [07:14]
  • “That’s the beauty of a church in a community is that we’re not going anywhere. Even if you disappoint us, even if you walk away, even if you don’t join my church and leave, you’re still in the neighborhood, and it’s still my job to love you and serve you.” -Rev. Matt Rawle [31:26]



  • [00:00] Intro
  • [02:55] Permission to play
  • [08:24] Transformation is in the hands of God
  • [10:02] Influence over authority
  • [13:20] Three marathons… 
  • [18:59] Less will give more
  • [24:11] Lessening the generation gap
  • [29:03] Community focus is more important than ever
  • [37:05] Outro



Three Articles on Trends

Today’s episode references 1) Carey Nieuwhof’s 12 Disruptive Church Trends that Will Rule 2022, 2) Joe Park’s Seven Trends to Watch in 2022, and 3) Thom Rainer’s Ten (Very Different) Church Trends for 2022.


Email and Enter a Drawing for a Free Book

What trends are you noticing? We’d love to hear from you! Email Lisa (lgreenwood@tmf-fdn.org) your reflections on trends and we’ll enter your name into a drawing for a free copy of Gil Rendle’s book “Quietly Courageous.” We’ll pick three names next Wednesday (2/16)


Posts Related to Today’s Episode 

Matt Rawle’s recent blogpost “The Center of Nine” expands on what he shares in our conversation, including the “Three Covid Marathons” he sees and his thoughts on what it means to “Abide.” Dan Bracken is a member of Rachel Billups’s team at Ginghamsburg Church and wrote this piece about their first steps into ministry in the metaverse


New Feature: Transcripts for this Season’s Episodes

We will have transcripts for each of our episodes this season. Visit our website to download this week’s transcript. We hope these additional resources will help you share these conversations with your friends, colleagues, and leadership teams to spark the spirit within you, your organization, and “ignite imagination!”


This podcast is brought to you by the Leadership Ministry team at TMF and Wesleyan Investive. Leadership Ministry connects diverse, high-capacity leaders in conversations and environments that create a network of courage, learning, and innovation in order to help the church lean into its God-appointed mission.

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Matt Rawle’s Bio:

Matt is the Lead Pastor at Asbury United Methodist Church in Bossier City, Louisiana and a graduate from the LSU School of Music and Duke Divinity School. He is an international speaker who loves to tell an old story in a new way, especially at the intersection of pop culture and the church. Matt is also the author of The Heart that Grew Three Sizes, The Grace of Les Misérables, What Makes a Hero?, The Faith of a Mockingbird, Hollywood Jesus, The Salvation of Doctor Who, and The Redemption of Scrooge. He and wife Christie have four awesome kids: Isabelle, Annaleigh, Cecilia, and Robert.


Rachel Billups’ Bio:

Rachel Billups is a visionary, leader, speaker and author. Currently she serves as Senior Pastor at Ginghamsburg Church multi-campus ministry in Tipp City/Dayton Ohio. Rachel draws on her love of people and passion to explore new venues for ministry and mission. 

Rachel is an ordained Elder within the United Methodist Church and holds a Bachelor’s Degree in Bible/Religion and History from Anderson University and a Master of Divinity Degree from Duke Divinity School.

Most days you can find Rachel reaching out – praying online, hosting Open Table gatherings in her home or enjoying moments with husband Jon and their four loves: Adeline, Christopher, David and Sarah. She also might be cheering for those Duke Blue Devils and The OSU Buckeyes. 

Rachel is a popular speaker for national gatherings and has recently authored BE BOLD: Finding your Fierce as well as co-authoring Down to Earth: Hopes and Fears of all the Year Are Met in Thee Tonight and Sent: Delivering the Gift of Hope at Christmas – all published by Abingdon Press. You can find her on social media at: @rlbillups.

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